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	<title>Comments on: Does your site really need to be in Google News?</title>
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	<description>Focusing on the future of digital journalism</description>
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		<title>By: Tom Grubisich</title>
		<link>http://www.ojr.org/p1791/#comment-2114</link>
		<dc:creator>Tom Grubisich</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 30 Oct 2009 14:53:17 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.ojr.org/?p=1791#comment-2114</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[What I find interesting, even ironic (in this post-ironic era) are the suggestions in some of the comments that community-based websites should seek meta traffic to build value.  Robert, who owns several community-based sites, knows whereof he speaks.  Metasized traffic is not only of no value to community sites, but may seduce those sites who get Google-ized traffic to try to build a business model around remnant-based advertising revenue that yields them 10 to 50 cents/CPM, which is the road to ruin.

Community-based entrepreneurs would do better, I think, if they figured out how to provide added (unique) value to their sites.  Since most community sites are content-starved, this may not be an impossible challenge.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>What I find interesting, even ironic (in this post-ironic era) are the suggestions in some of the comments that community-based websites should seek meta traffic to build value.  Robert, who owns several community-based sites, knows whereof he speaks.  Metasized traffic is not only of no value to community sites, but may seduce those sites who get Google-ized traffic to try to build a business model around remnant-based advertising revenue that yields them 10 to 50 cents/CPM, which is the road to ruin.</p>
<p>Community-based entrepreneurs would do better, I think, if they figured out how to provide added (unique) value to their sites.  Since most community sites are content-starved, this may not be an impossible challenge.</p>
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		<title>By: Perry Gaskill</title>
		<link>http://www.ojr.org/p1791/#comment-2113</link>
		<dc:creator>Perry Gaskill</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 29 Oct 2009 08:55:26 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.ojr.org/?p=1791#comment-2113</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Interesting post, and I tend to think one of the reasons the online news discussion hasn&#039;t explored some of these ideas is because things tend to revolve around the top-down business model of major metro dailies. If you assume higher reader engagement equals higher advertising ROI and therefore higher CPMs, it starts to change the shape of an alternative bottom-up model. I&#039;ve said this before: Why would a local hardware store owner in California expect to sell a hammer to a kid in Bulgaria? Also: Is it better to sell ads against 200,000 page hits at $.50 per CPM, or is it better to sell against 20,000 localized page hits at $20 per CPM?

And it seems to me that the two potential main downsides of trying to target for engaged local readers fall into two areas: 1) Communities acting as points of destination where there&#039;s a higher percentage of business catering to tourism, for example, or 2) Out-of-Area site visitors, such as former residents, who have a specific interest in the community. Both of which have imperfect but workable solutions.

Mostly those solutions would involve the use of page redirects based on a combination of IP address lookups, cookies, and reader registration. Tourists looking for lodging or events, for example, are guided through visitor-specific site content with appropriate advertising as a visitor vertical. None of the site content needs to be locked down necessarily, it&#039;s just that the navigational controls are different and arguably more useful to the visitor.

The second potential pitfall, that of out-of-area residents, also presents a possible opportunity. Say, for example, you&#039;re getting page hits from a former local high school student who is now in the military and stationed in Beirut, or a former local bank branch manager now with a firm in Singapore. In both situations, any editor with an ounce of curiosity is probably going to wonder &quot;what&#039;s up with that?&quot; And come to the conclusion that local readers might wonder too. ]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Interesting post, and I tend to think one of the reasons the online news discussion hasn&#8217;t explored some of these ideas is because things tend to revolve around the top-down business model of major metro dailies. If you assume higher reader engagement equals higher advertising ROI and therefore higher CPMs, it starts to change the shape of an alternative bottom-up model. I&#8217;ve said this before: Why would a local hardware store owner in California expect to sell a hammer to a kid in Bulgaria? Also: Is it better to sell ads against 200,000 page hits at $.50 per CPM, or is it better to sell against 20,000 localized page hits at $20 per CPM?</p>
<p>And it seems to me that the two potential main downsides of trying to target for engaged local readers fall into two areas: 1) Communities acting as points of destination where there&#8217;s a higher percentage of business catering to tourism, for example, or 2) Out-of-Area site visitors, such as former residents, who have a specific interest in the community. Both of which have imperfect but workable solutions.</p>
<p>Mostly those solutions would involve the use of page redirects based on a combination of IP address lookups, cookies, and reader registration. Tourists looking for lodging or events, for example, are guided through visitor-specific site content with appropriate advertising as a visitor vertical. None of the site content needs to be locked down necessarily, it&#8217;s just that the navigational controls are different and arguably more useful to the visitor.</p>
<p>The second potential pitfall, that of out-of-area residents, also presents a possible opportunity. Say, for example, you&#8217;re getting page hits from a former local high school student who is now in the military and stationed in Beirut, or a former local bank branch manager now with a firm in Singapore. In both situations, any editor with an ounce of curiosity is probably going to wonder &#8220;what&#8217;s up with that?&#8221; And come to the conclusion that local readers might wonder too. </p>
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		<title>By: Dave Chase</title>
		<link>http://www.ojr.org/p1791/#comment-2112</link>
		<dc:creator>Dave Chase</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 28 Oct 2009 19:00:03 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.ojr.org/?p=1791#comment-2112</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Like one of the commenters, we (www.sunvalleyonline.com) are in Google News however I think you are right on the focus point. I.e., community traffic is far more valuable. We have never had (or made) the time/resources to focus on SEO. Last time I checked, we were self-generating 88% of our own traffic (mainly newsletter links but bookmarking, etc. are a part of the mix).

I think the biggest barrier is ego. Just as print publishers have inflated their #&#039;s, online publishers want to have big #&#039;s in part to compare against inflated #&#039;s. Over time, smart marketers will realize that more engaged (i.e., greater time spent) consumers are more receptive to advertising and will use that metric over sheer tonnage.

Having said that, converting a higher percentage of the drive-by traffic is something most of us can improve upon.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Like one of the commenters, we (www.sunvalleyonline.com) are in Google News however I think you are right on the focus point. I.e., community traffic is far more valuable. We have never had (or made) the time/resources to focus on SEO. Last time I checked, we were self-generating 88% of our own traffic (mainly newsletter links but bookmarking, etc. are a part of the mix).</p>
<p>I think the biggest barrier is ego. Just as print publishers have inflated their #&#8217;s, online publishers want to have big #&#8217;s in part to compare against inflated #&#8217;s. Over time, smart marketers will realize that more engaged (i.e., greater time spent) consumers are more receptive to advertising and will use that metric over sheer tonnage.</p>
<p>Having said that, converting a higher percentage of the drive-by traffic is something most of us can improve upon.</p>
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		<title>By: Robert Niles</title>
		<link>http://www.ojr.org/p1791/#comment-2111</link>
		<dc:creator>Robert Niles</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 28 Oct 2009 13:39:21 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.ojr.org/?p=1791#comment-2111</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Great example from the second comment:

The anecdotal data suggests that you, as a Google News reader, don&#039;t spend as much time with the local news site as a reader who has bookmarked it, types its URL directly to check the headlines, or who subscribes to its e-mail newsletter, Facebook page or Twitter feed.

So, if the local news site isn&#039;t in Google News yet, I&#039;m suggesting that site can find more readers who will spend greater time with through other avenues than trying to get into Google News.

Most online news start-ups are very small, under-funded and strapped for time. Go for the juiciest, low-hanging fruit first. Look *first* for people who will make a commitment to the site and its community - not to people who will drive-by for individual stories via Google News.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Great example from the second comment:</p>
<p>The anecdotal data suggests that you, as a Google News reader, don&#8217;t spend as much time with the local news site as a reader who has bookmarked it, types its URL directly to check the headlines, or who subscribes to its e-mail newsletter, Facebook page or Twitter feed.</p>
<p>So, if the local news site isn&#8217;t in Google News yet, I&#8217;m suggesting that site can find more readers who will spend greater time with through other avenues than trying to get into Google News.</p>
<p>Most online news start-ups are very small, under-funded and strapped for time. Go for the juiciest, low-hanging fruit first. Look *first* for people who will make a commitment to the site and its community &#8211; not to people who will drive-by for individual stories via Google News.</p>
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		<title>By: 76.175.160.229</title>
		<link>http://www.ojr.org/p1791/#comment-2110</link>
		<dc:creator>76.175.160.229</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 28 Oct 2009 11:50:19 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.ojr.org/?p=1791#comment-2110</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Great post and solid advice in the midst of all SEO craziness. This should be required reading to anyone who&#039;s getting introduced with traffic statistics and analytics.

Pekka Pekkala
Specialized Journalism program, USC Annenberg]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Great post and solid advice in the midst of all SEO craziness. This should be required reading to anyone who&#8217;s getting introduced with traffic statistics and analytics.</p>
<p>Pekka Pekkala<br />
Specialized Journalism program, USC Annenberg</p>
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		<title>By: 66.186.116.126</title>
		<link>http://www.ojr.org/p1791/#comment-2109</link>
		<dc:creator>66.186.116.126</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 28 Oct 2009 11:47:24 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.ojr.org/?p=1791#comment-2109</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[So for all those tech-savvy residents who use Google News to keep track of news in their local community (which I do), it&#039;s great if my local newspaper isn&#039;t included? Because, um, why exactly is that again? The paper only wants readers it has a relationship with? It doesn&#039;t want to find new readers interested in what it writes about so it can entice at least some of them into coming back?

Saying you don&#039;t want &quot;drive-by&quot; readers from search is like a retailer saying they don&#039;t want to offer specials to get customers in the door. If you can&#039;t convert a reasonable amount of readers who arrive via a search engine from drive-by visitors to returnees, the problem may not be Google News, but how you&#039;ve designed your Web site -- more specifically, whether your article pages have been created in such a way as to compel a 1st-time visitor to do something else.

 ]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>So for all those tech-savvy residents who use Google News to keep track of news in their local community (which I do), it&#8217;s great if my local newspaper isn&#8217;t included? Because, um, why exactly is that again? The paper only wants readers it has a relationship with? It doesn&#8217;t want to find new readers interested in what it writes about so it can entice at least some of them into coming back?</p>
<p>Saying you don&#8217;t want &#8220;drive-by&#8221; readers from search is like a retailer saying they don&#8217;t want to offer specials to get customers in the door. If you can&#8217;t convert a reasonable amount of readers who arrive via a search engine from drive-by visitors to returnees, the problem may not be Google News, but how you&#8217;ve designed your Web site &#8212; more specifically, whether your article pages have been created in such a way as to compel a 1st-time visitor to do something else.</p>
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		<title>By: Barry Parr</title>
		<link>http://www.ojr.org/p1791/#comment-2108</link>
		<dc:creator>Barry Parr</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 28 Oct 2009 10:24:33 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.ojr.org/?p=1791#comment-2108</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Coastsider has been in Google News for a few years, so I can give you some additional perspective on this issue.

Google News only results in a small share of our traffic (2%) and most of that (80%) from returning visitors, according to Google Analytics.

But if someone is searching for news on Half Moon Bay, California, I&#039;m glad Coastsider is on that results page.

Comment spam is not an issue on Coastsider. I don&#039;t permit registrations from places like Chine, Russia, and Eastern Europe. Also, no one can post without a real name and pre-approval, so I not only get zero comment spam, I have zero spam attempts. This is probably not a viable alternative for vertical sites with national and international audiences, but I believe it&#039;s essential if you serve a smaller community.

Bottom line: I&#039;m glad I&#039;m in Google News, but it&#039;s not necessary to succeed in community news.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Coastsider has been in Google News for a few years, so I can give you some additional perspective on this issue.</p>
<p>Google News only results in a small share of our traffic (2%) and most of that (80%) from returning visitors, according to Google Analytics.</p>
<p>But if someone is searching for news on Half Moon Bay, California, I&#8217;m glad Coastsider is on that results page.</p>
<p>Comment spam is not an issue on Coastsider. I don&#8217;t permit registrations from places like Chine, Russia, and Eastern Europe. Also, no one can post without a real name and pre-approval, so I not only get zero comment spam, I have zero spam attempts. This is probably not a viable alternative for vertical sites with national and international audiences, but I believe it&#8217;s essential if you serve a smaller community.</p>
<p>Bottom line: I&#8217;m glad I&#8217;m in Google News, but it&#8217;s not necessary to succeed in community news.</p>
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